Southampton banter 2

 

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29 Feb 2024 20:38:03
I have been quiet of late and not tried to over-react to the end of our unbeaten run.

However, during that run, we were lucky on a number of occasions and when good fortune ran out we saw some very poor outcomes and a good few 2 points lost on draws that should have been wins.

The writing was on the wall recently when teams stopped watching us fiddle about at the back and attacked us aggressively.

5-3, 1-3, 1-2 and 1-2 were all poor. How we won at WBA I do not know. Last night we lost to Liverpool U 21`s and Mara/Charles/Sulemana could not hit the proverbial barn door from 10 yards.

Yet still, RM is `proud` of his players, Well I feel sorry for them having to continue so rigidly to a system which will not get us back to the Premier League automatically.

Injuries are worrying/form needs to pick up NOW otherwise even playoffs could be in doubt. We have Ipswich/Leicester/Leeds to lose to yet.

RM needs to change his stubborn approach but he won`t. Failure will mean another year in the championship with a weaker squad and less money and RM still at St Mary`s.

Come on. Last chance to turn it around, starting at Birmingham,

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29 Feb 2024 21:50:25
Totally agree mate

29 Feb 2024 22:05:29
We won West Bromwich Albion, simply because they sat back and watched us play, l allowed us to play .
I was really disappointed with West Bromwich Albion, I hope they go for it.
But they literally let us keep possession and play ball around.
That’s how we won …
The unbeaten run, only cemented Russell Martins belief in himself and his system.
It’s surreal

28 Feb 2024 21:49:38
So sick and tired of watching player after player giving the ball away cheaply, game after game.

No leaders on the pitch at all - no quality in the final third - no game plan at all.

Losing to effectively Liverpool U21's - RM and team, simply pathetic. Shame on you all.

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28 Feb 2024 22:04:43
I learnt a few things tonight - I was wrong about Shea Charles - he’s even worse than I thought.

And as for Stephens, he never passes the ball, he only passes the responsibility.

Lumley, like Baz has been completely brain washed by RM - let’s play Russian roulette in our own box rather than clear to safety.

RM really isn’t Pep - his tactical substitutions failed to do anything other than weaken the side.

Not a lot else to say other than if you don’t take your chances you don’t win football matches.

Oh well - 3 points at Birmingham might lift the gloom

28 Feb 2024 22:09:21
We did compete but lack quality finishers. Liverpool knew that and just waited for us to give the ball away under high press which is exactly what we eventually did. 3-0 is harsh and unforgiving but so is the premier league. Really don’t think RM is the manager we need but don’t really see an obvious replacement.

28 Feb 2024 22:49:49
2408 - 100% RM is not the right man.

Would respectively disagree we competed tonight - and would also suggest that wasn’t the PL tonight, that was U21 level.

29 Feb 2024 08:59:43
We should have been 2-0 up in the first 15 minutes. It took Liverpool 30 minutes to work us out so I feel that we were competitive. Gomez dropped 10 yards to stop diagonal balls between centre and full backs. Elliot pushed forward 10 yards which sucked Aribo back and completely nullified his attacking threat. They hunted Charles and forced him into errors. Gakpo dropped 5 yards and pulled our centre backs out leaving our fullbacks square which allowed koumas and later Danns space in between the centre and full backs. In short, Klopp tweaked the shape and tactic, RM didn’t.

29 Feb 2024 15:20:55
Martin and his stubbornness will be his downfall and that of Southampton football club this season. I wish our run of games was not against lower opposition as it falsely bigged up his way of playing.
The subtle changes by Liverpool for the reason that Klopp is successful…. Martin continuously changes players not tactics. What an earth he thought Smallbone could bring the Team, I have no idea… Our last game is statistics were unbelievable… Zero tackles in 90 minutes, just one of them. I watched him last night, he neither tackled, nor attempted to get the ball, …
And what did Martin say at the end?, we will take that style into the next game…
Disappointed with Mara and Edozie . Half hearted, pressing, half hearted running…
Sadly, it was all a false Dawn for the Saints, which is only boosted Martin’s ego even more…
We were playing two and three meter passes in our own box? Dangerous passes!
Liverpool held the ball in defence for a matter of seconds, their transition play was accurate and fast.
Meanwhile, we continue to mess around with it at the back like we are some Manchester City. Who instantly move the ball from defence to attack in seconds.
Martin is simply not good enough, and his tactics are destroying us. we were passing back to the goalkeeper three nil down with two minutes to go

26 Feb 2024 23:10:49
Any chance we can skip Wednesday trip to anfield. Even if Klopp puts out a lesser team we won't get anything from the game.

May as well forfiet it and use the days as training or focus for the games to come, because we ain't premiership quality at the moment and we definitely ain't premiership opposition to the league leaders at their home ground kind of quality either.

Let's scrap it and move on ?

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27 Feb 2024 20:08:59
We’re light years away from PL quality.

If we did go up (and I hope we do) we will be battered week in week out. We won’t be able to play RM’s possession/obsession football because we won’t have the ball long enough.

We would need a squad overhaul and actually our better players this year are loanees. So whatever way you look at it, we are royally cattle trucked.

26 Feb 2024 19:09:03
Is the writing on the wall already?
2003 fa cup
2010 jpl
2017 elf
2024 play offs?

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26 Feb 2024 20:43:14
We need to change to make the playoffs .
I think we will, because we have had such a strong run, but no one will fear us now and everyone will try and beat us…
Martin wasn’t earning his money against lesser opposition, now we are playing some really good clubs, and clubs like Millwall, who found us out.
He needs to have a little chat with Buddha

Cheick Doucoure

24 Feb 2024 19:44:45
{Ed's Note - Ed001 has posted a new player profile about, Cheick Doucoure

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24 Feb 2024 17:02:40
Two words - sack Martin.

Do it now, not next week nor next month.

He's too arrogant to change his ways and his way doesn't work - not effectively and not when it matters.

But of course - this won't happen. Our Board have far lower expectations than the fans like us posters.

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24 Feb 2024 22:13:36
How have we went from 25 win streak to a 3 game loosing streaks I can't lie I should have faith in the team hut currently the form is abysmal and I don't think we will win in the play offs.


Some players seriously make my head go in.

Sacking Martin idk but change the players that our loosing possession etc.


Furthermore I keep hearing g news of potential new strikers that sound good but they never come over the line ik it ain't transfer season but surely we need to have a peak around?

24 Feb 2024 17:01:04
Our possession game just isn't working. 80% possession against a mediocre side like Millwall and we lose again.

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24 Feb 2024 21:41:00
RM system was always going to be limited in time and efficiency especially when analysed by good quality coaches. The team play in a repetitive manner that has taken championship quality coaches 20 odd matches to work out but premiership coaches would take 2/3 matches! The sad thing is that the pace and guile we have in wide positions is exceptional, Stu and Downes are premier league quality but none of our central strikers are. AA and Adams miss way to many chances and Mara needs a 12 month loan in the championship to hone his skills allowing Saints to make a final decision about him. The team needs to be rotated and some of the really important players rested in preparation for the playoffs, our system might well work against tired and battle-scarred squads at the end of 46 games. ?

26 Feb 2024 17:03:20
I don’t think it even needed good coaches to see through his ways.
He is obsessed with possession football, but he doesn’t care where on the pitch that is.
When you watch good teams play possession football, it can be a joy to watch. its speed, its cleverness, all the time working that opening. It only takes one opponent to be moved/coerced out of position, and suddenly the killer pass, the switch up a gear play.
suddenly it’s 2 on 1, 3 on 2 .

With us, we just seem to keep the ball for the sake of it. and as for the passing across the box, passing back to the goalkeeper when he’s marked, the goalkeeper trying to play as a sweeper while surrounded by the opponents .

When the opponent sits back, it makes us look good!
When they don’t, we are outplayed, out! thought.

I knew we had the best teams to come, but crikey . I now realise we aren’t in their league. Correction ; maybe the players are, but the puppet master is an amateur!
I’m not actually sure now we will make the playoffs, if we do it will be because of our head start.
Gone has the psychological win over opponents before the game started.
Teams will watch the videos back and absolutely relish playing us.
With Fraser on one wing and Stuey on the other (as per 2408s post) .
we have two players that love to run at the opponents .
how frustrating to be waiting around for the ball, while Buffoona messes around with it!

But even when we aren’t winning, even when we are losing, Martin never changes tactics. he just changes players!

There is a reason he has never succeeded as a manager. there is a reason every team he’s managed has gone backwards

23 Feb 2024 07:41:10
3 thoughts on our current position

1. We are vulnerable playing out from the back and without Downes. Teams are no longer scared of us and we have lost momentum.

2. RM needs to mix it up and his single mindedness cnmcerns me. Against the press, we need to go long down the channels every now and then to make the opposition cautious.

3. Still, I am grateful for the exciting promotion chase. Earlier in the season, at the start of our run, the most likely scenario was a dull switching between 4th and 6th for 25+ games until the playoffs and probably losing to Leeds. Now anything can happen and every game matters.

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23 Feb 2024 20:43:49
Well written post …
Well, written post .
Ive used the example of the WBA away game as an example …
I was really expecting a close game, but what I watched was a game where WBA sat back and let us play the ball around like a 6 a side friendly .
They never really pressed us, they never closed down. they literally let us play! Play
And that is exactly what happened for over 20 games, coupled with the non losing streak, coupled with the amazing scenario of playing none of the top clubs!

I watched the run, thinking, any coach worry his money will not allow us the freedom, they certainly won’t allow us the freedom to play suicidal passes in and around the box. I’m not sure I’ve seen so many dangerous passes in one game; to be honest there are more dangerous passes played by saints in one game than I see in a season .

So now Martins style has been broken, we are in trouble unless we change!
Hull pressed us superbly, they hunted us down, there was no sitting and watching us play with the ball!

Unless Martin changes tactics, we will only just make the playoffs .
as I posted before, unbelievable that we changed nothing ….

23 Feb 2024 21:50:08
Totally agree with what’s been written - nothing more to say other than watch and weep as Leeds turn things round against Leicester

24 Feb 2024 08:39:05
Hull took is apart, so as it stands I would rather be 4th and play West Brom in the first playoff and hope Ipswich beat Hull.

Second is still possible but only if we play our best team, learn to play against the press, win the 6 pointers and get a bit of luck!

24 Feb 2024 14:23:29
It’s amazing to look at this table and think we could end up with 100 points and still not go up! It looks likely there will be four teams with 90+ points, when in your average championship season you’re almost guaranteed to go up with around 87.

Regardless of the tactical issues etc currently needing addressing, we have little to fear bar those three away at the top three - I’d fancy our chances at Ipswich, hope we won’t lose at Leicester, then it would all come down to that final day where who knows what could happen.

Leicester are falling back, Ipswich had a run of 1 win in 9, we’ve lost 2 in 3, Leeds were about 7 back of us until February. There are more twists yet - Leeds won’t win every game between now and May, and I think Leicester are catchable.

Just enjoy the ride and hope that if it comes to it, we don’t bottle the play-offs ?

21 Feb 2024 18:21:43
I would love to see Tyler Dibbs get a run in the teams, more importantly I would love Adam Armstrong NOT to be in the team and Tyler or anyone or no one else o take his place. He's scored some goals for us this season Armstrong sure but if you look into it they've mostly been from winning positions, goals that haven't really meant much to the overall outcome of the game. What I mean by that is he isn't someone who could be relied on. We were 2-0 against hull and I never had any hope of changing that until Che came on. I'm not saying I believed Che would score but he's has a far more overall presence and variety to his game then Armstrong. Should we happen to get promoted he's only going to get worse as we all saw his performance in the premiership and this new stint in the championship hasn't exactly shown him for the start striker he's supposed to be. Give Tyler a chance, he can't be any worse but at best he goes on to be immense and he's home grown.

Also a side note on goalkeepers. Maybe it's because I've been watching saints for too much recently but when was the last time anyone saw a goalkeeper to a successful run of saves?! By that I mean, a shot comes at the goalkeeper, he dives and saves it it one or two hands and pushes it behind for a corner or out of danger. These days all I see is our keepers acting like their defenders, running around with ball at their feet and when they do actually make a diving save they push it right it front of players .it'sike attacking players know this more these days and await for the ball to be pushed to them.Think somethings gone wrong with goalkeeper coaching because they don't do the basics anymore. Dive, save goalkeeping 101 .pep rush keeper are awesome but that should be second to dive and save. If I was on a million pounds contract you could be your ass I'd have the skills to dive and save a ball. ?

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20 Feb 2024 23:28:47
While we all cringed and winced at Russell Martin's tactic of playing out from the back,
It all seem to be going so well with our run of games.
Well, all it took was one decent manager to think, we are not going to sit back and watch this pretty football, messing around with it at the back, we're going to go for them.
And then Hull tonight, a classy football team, moving the ball round superbly.
But best of all, they weren't putting up with our absolute nonsense of playing out from the back at every opportunity!
So Mr Martin, your tactic has been found out.
So what's next on offer from you?

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21 Feb 2024 05:43:17
Unfortunately this is not unexpected.Russell Martin has been usurped by another impressive young Manager’s tactics yet again.There are probably 4/5 Championship Managers capable of holding their own in the Premier League but Martin is not one of of them.He’s done Ok but in my opinion lacks the skill to advance much further.Hull City with only one recogniseable name (Carvallo) but a well drilled outfit under astute young Manager Liam Rosenior.I would be delighted to be proved wrong it’s likely our chances of automatic promotion have just been scuppered and through Play Offs quite unlikely on this showing.A Home win next Saturday won’t encourage any flags to be raised just yet!

{Ed001's Note - did Morton not play for Hull? He is also there on loan from Liverpool and is a very good young midfielder.}

21 Feb 2024 08:27:09
Yes EDS Morton is a good player and did emerge from their bench but my point was were these two players plus their team mates expected to trump the plethora of full and young internationals at Saints disposal (probably as many as all other Championship sides combined) tells a story!

{Ed001's Note - sorry mate I was just wondering as I don't get to see a lot of him out on loan.}

21 Feb 2024 10:05:58
Morton was superb.
It was a clever, fluid, dynamic manger manager versus Martin
While our run was very impressive, we did have an amazing run of playing lower teams.
I honestly think that teams had started to give us too much respect, allowing us space and time to play the slow and very predictable way.
WBA was a perfect example. they just sat back and watched us play around with the ball, moving it freely, back to the goalkeeper, across the box passes!

Hill we’re having none of it. by stopping us play, we were lost. We still had higher possession first half but I think Hulk had 10 shots versus our 2. because the possession was as usual in our half.

The time that Martin has to earn his money,
Now we’ve lost twice in three games, no team will show us that respect. I honestly think teams had them mentality that they weren’t going to beat us.
Allowing us to control the game.
Those days have gone!
What I can’t believe is that he didn’t change anything in the first half when we were clearly totally being outplayed.
Even more bizarre to be playing, the same possession, football with minutes to go and losing!

{Ed001's Note - thank you for that.

I never understand managers that can't even adjust for a final flurry with minutes left in a match. It shows a lack of flexibility that is beyond being merely stubborn. You have to react to circumstances.}

21 Feb 2024 22:41:15
Call me old fashioned, but it might help if he picks our strongest team from the start.

Just saying

22 Feb 2024 12:14:12
Millertime .
Stop posting silly comments .
pick our best team?
Have you been drinking?
Next you’ll be asking why he keeps picking AA, why he ever picks stephens and why he changes a winning and settled team!
On the subject of AA .
Absolutely back to the greedy old self, shooting at every opportunity, never passing to a team mate in a much better position .

22 Feb 2024 21:06:51
Haha South Hants Rich, personally I think AA is invaluable (I’m talking about Alcoholics Anonymous obviously) although drink is the only remedy to get us through this, I’m sure.

Seriously though AA doesn’t have a sharp footballing brain even though he does occasionally find himself in the right place at the right time. He is thoughtless rather than selfish because most of the great strikers are the latter, but if you are able to combine awareness of team mates around you who are in a better scoring position then you become a top striker.

And that is what we lack presently, we never did replace Danny Ings.

 


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